Would You Boycott Yahoo?

28 comments

as that is what the National Union of Journos are asking for from all their members.

I'll let the NUJ say it in their own words

Quote:
The National Union of Journalists is advising its 40,000 members to boycott all Yahoo! products and services in protest at its repeated collusion with the Chinese authorities.

Via El Reg

Comments

No

No no no... what silliness.

NO

Fing unions

SO

So we all agree that the Chinese governments OK then?

Why?

I don't think it would do any good anyway and don't other SE make exceptions for China also?

Do

I'd been a Yahoo user since '97 and advertiser for a little over a year. Not anymore!

I do miss what they have to offer but I'll live.

Google? It would hurt me financially but I'd do it.

Money's not everything.

At the time the demand was

Quote:
At the time the demand was made for information in this case, Yahoo! China was legally obligated to comply with the requirements of Chinese law enforcement.
Quote:
When a foreign telecommunications company operating in the United States receives an order from U.S. law enforcement, it must comply

Is there anything else to say?

Silly Season

I'm going to quote myself here, excuse the harsh tone:

If people in other countries don't like being censored, let them overthrow their fucking government, it's not our problem

I'd have to say I largely

I'd have to say I largely agree IncridiBILL. Lest we forget, the relative freedoms enjoyed by the US and UK public are both founded on some fairly vicious wars a few hundred years ago

If people in other countries

If people in other countries don't like being censored, let them overthrow their fucking government, it's not our problem

Therein lies the catch 22. Activists are being turned in to the Chinese government by Yahoo. How can they overturn the government without free speech, or at least the anonymity to spread ideas of freedom without the threat of reprisal from an overbearing communist government?

As for having people seeking freedom fend for themselves, I think it's sad that many Americans forget the role that other countries have played in helping us in the US gain our independence. France, for instance, literally went broke funding the US revolutionary war.

As for compliance, I'm sure many people made fortunes complying to world thugs like Hitler, or many people would have liked for the early Americans to comply to Britain's ever increasing oppresive commands but thankfully these were in the minority.

>> How can they overturn

>> How can they overturn the government without free speech, or at least the anonymity to spread ideas of freedom without the threat of reprisal

We managed it, as did the US

>> We managed it, as did the US

Where are you from TallTroll?

UK - home of arguably the

UK - home of arguably the oldest democracy on Earth (if you don't count Iceland, and allow that the classical Greek model of democracy would not qualify as such by todays standards)

So are they going to boycott

So are they going to boycott MSN and Google as well?

Is anyone business in China clean?

Hell, can any multinational corp really stand tall on ethics?

Yahoo does more good than harm in China

The idea of boycotting yahoo because they helped turn in a journalist is totally ridiculous. Yahoo does so much more good than bad when it comes to empowering individual freedoms in China.

Most people who have a good working knowledge of China realize that the internet has provided Chinese citizens to speak there mind to a degree which far exceeds anything that anyone could have imagined ten years ago. And it is the major internet players, like yahoo, who are providing the places and the tools to do this.

hold on, hold on....

>> Lest we forget, the relative freedoms enjoyed by the US and UK public

"Relative" is a good word. Here in the UK, relative to twenty years ago, it's like living in a communist country. ;-)

boycott one

boycott them all, its a compromise if you want to do business in China, not unreasonable for a corporation to play by the local rules (however sad and unjust those rules may be).

If congress were serious they would pull a Cuba and just embargo China but its less risky to just bluster and blame corporate america.

BTW, commerce can plant the seeds of political change, check out Armand Hammer.

Arm & Hammer (Armond Hammer)

Funny, according to this he tried to buy Arm & Hammer and actually controlled it for a while as a director and shareholder.

Hey TallTroll, who said

Quote:
We managed it, as did the US

Do you think you could do it again today? How about tomorrow? I have little sympathy for quitters, but at the same time I have great respect for those who know firsthand what it is like to resist on that scale today. Living here in the US, I recognize that I have no idea of what it really takes - yet I see all the signs of preparations to defend against it.

Isn't it about time the

Isn't it about time the Americans overthrew their government? At least the Chinese don't go round making war whenever the president has an old grudge to settle.

And don't the US throw journalists in jail too?

Let's see how you guys manage it against a modern military :-p

modern military

If the government used a modern military against a domestic target this place would come unglued. The population in any country outsizes the government, so oppression is silly except in smaller numbers suffer as personal fear and intimidation play a factor.

It's like a single hijacker with a gun on a plane, the actual hijacker casualties possible against the mob vs the total destruction after forcing a pilot to crash is a huge differemce, yet people sit in their chairs like lemmings yet the odds are with the total passenger manifest vs. 10 bullets.

Likewise, do the math of population vs government, personal safety is the only thing stopping overthrows, people don't have the same sense of fighting the greater good they used to.

please don't wish that

Even though I have heard (possibly false) rumours that you guys in the US have a constitutional right to overthrow your government, please don't wish for your armed forces to attack you. They surely will, if and as soon as they're ordered to.

Personally I would prefer a peaceful and democratic solution, but I am not able to tell exactly how much democracy you really have left at this point, as I don't know enough about it. I am pretty sceptical due to all the writings about your last election and special laws being passed since then.

As for Yahoo, journalists always make a lot of noise in any case involving journalists. And they should.

-------------
Disclaimer:
I am neither a democrat nor a republican, as those parties don't even exist over here.

>> Do you think you could do

>> Do you think you could do it again today? How about tomorrow?

We managed it against a regime more oppressive than anything the Chinese leadership dare dream of - we rebelled against the divine right of kings. The Church was the most powerful political entity in Europe, the nobility had most of the money, most of the troops and weapons, and thousands of years of tradition on their side.

I think that modern technology makes it easier, rather than harder, to effect political change, not least because it makes a less violent resolution more possible. Note that several Communist regimes have fallen in Europe over the las 20 years or so with remarkably little bloodshed.

"Traditional" US doctrine would have required WWIII to liberate Eastern Europe - instead they did it themslevs, at a time, and in a manner that made sense for them, with considerable success. Why should China ultimately be any different?

Now we're starting to dig

Now we're starting to dig deeper.

Eastern Europe fell mainly for economic reasons. Western trade embargoes, an out of control arms race, a harmfull central control of enterprise.

If such worked against communist totaliatarian governments in the past then why shouldn't they work now with China? Why do the US and other western countries continue to trade with China? Doesn't George Bush and his followers claim that bringing freedom and democracy to other lands to be a worthy cause?

IncrediBILL, I knew you'd

IncrediBILL, I knew you'd come around!

Communication is vital to forming and keeping an open and free democracy. For instance, consider what happened on flight United 93 -the hijacked airliner that was thwarted by passengers on 911.

The hijackers were telling the passengers that their demands were met and that they were returning to the airport. However, the passengers were also recieving information via their cellphones that other planes were part of a suicide mission. Because of the passengers access to alternative information they weighed their options, figured their odds, and perhaps averted an even larger tragedy. They had access to communication.

The totalitarian government of China knows what the consequences are to open access of communication for its people.

Who REALLY runs the planet

The actual new rulers of the world have a huge presence in china and nobody seems to care. This is the same company that sells all sorts of CENSORED material in the U.S. and destroys the local economy (stores, papers, etc.) of every city where a store opens and the people end up working for much less and without insurance and other benefits they previously had.

I think the Walmart brand of oppression would make Stalin proud, and it much worse than Yahoo complying with Chinese government requests, much more insidious in how it manifests.

Check out the Big Box Mart spoof on JibJab. It's pretty damn funny unless it happened to you, and it's happened to many.

I don't shop there, do you?

>>The population in any

>>The population in any country outsizes the government, so oppression is silly except in smaller numbers suffer as personal fear and intimidation play a factor.

Right Bill. In a traditional economy. But what about this one?

http://www.threadwatch.org/node/6246

You want to go first? The first 100,000 need to take a bullet :)

Principles are no good if you are dead, like those poor bastards in Tiannamen Square.

Martyrs

>> Principles are no good if you are dead

That's what they call martyrs, and given enough martyrs people will get the idea they aren't safe either and revolt.

Who needs Yahoo?

When every telecom company in the world is fighting for market share in China, who needs Yahoo for information? They'll just text each other.

If congress were serious they would pull a Cuba and just embargo China but its less risky to just bluster and blame corporate america.

You mean if congress were completely stupid. It wouldnt be risky, it would be economic suicide. Without the Chinese funding our debt, interest rates would be 12% instead of 6%+. That would solve the WalMart issue though, as a large percentage of their customers would no longer be able to buy their crap with maxed out credit cards at 25%. WalMart would then have to slow down their importing of cheap chinese goods produced by 6 year olds and political dissidents.

Hey, maybe the solution is to have Coalition forces invade Walmart. Anyone know if the Waltons are democrats? That would be cause enough for the present administration (if they are republicans we just move the timetable back until after the 2008 election) and we wouldnt even have to go to the UN for permission.

Republicans

Quote:
Anyone know if the Waltons are democrats?

They have to be republicans - they censor the stuff (DVDs/CDs) they sell.

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