Ex-CIA Agent Steele Says We Can No Longer Trust Google


Ars Technica points to HSToday.us, an information resource site for homeland security decision makers, which notes that its sources within the intelligence community confirmed a Google/CIA parternship in January of 2006.

From the article (registration required -- it's free)

Google’s alleged secret relationship with the US intelligence community (IC) was divulged by an IT contractor and confirmed by US intelligence authorities familiar with the matter during the OSS.Net IOP conference near Washington, DC. The contractor, who spoke on a not-for-attribution basis, said that at least one US intelligence agency he declined to identify is working to “leverage Google’s [user] data monitoring” capability as part of an effort by the IC to glean from this data information of “national security intelligence interest” in the war on terror.

The article also quotes Robert Steele, whom we met in the previous post on this topic. He had this to say:

I have no doubt that Google, in its arrogance, decided it could make a deal with the devil and not get caught.

In my view, Google is a public resource and must remain purer than Ceasar's wife. I am sympathetic to Google's rolling over for China and agreeing to curtail some content - that can be reversed later. However, I am very unsympathetic and critical of Google for violating its ‘do no harm’ rule. In my view, a secret financial and secret information sharing relationship with the US Intelligence Community - or any other intelligence community - violates everything about Google that should be sacred, and suggests that we can no longer trust them to live up to their original ethos.

There is far more about this topic in the HSToday article (free registration required). The article is from January of 2006, and states that Google's relationship with the intelligence community is quasi-open.


No Harm?

I thought they "do no evil"? They do plenty of harm, and by design. I'm sure there are thousands of small businesses that have closed because of their actions and collateral damage with new updates, data pushes, bad-data-pushes, etc. On the other hand, there are also thousands of small businesses that are making money because of google.

oh dear

>>to “leverage Google’s [user] data monitoring” capability as part of an effort by the IC to glean from this data information of “national security intelligence interest” in the war on terror.

There must be so many terror keywords on threadwatch now that the men in black will be swinging into action any second.

Reminds me of this joke:

An old Arab lived close to New York City for more than 40 years. He would have loved to plant potatoes in his garden, but he is alone, old and weak. His son is in college in Paris, so the old man sends him an e-mail. He explains the problem: "Beloved son, I am very sad, because I can't plant potatoes in my garden. I am sure, if only you were here, you would help and dig up the garden for me. I love you, Your Father"

The following day, the old man receives a response e-mail from his son: "Beloved Father, Please don't touch the garden. It's there that I have hidden 'the THING'. I love you, too, Ahmed"

At 4pm the FBI, the CIA and the Rangers visit the house of the old man, take the whole garden apart, search every inch, but can't find anything. Disappointed they leave the house.

A day later, the old man receives another e-mail from his son. "Beloved Father, I hope the garden is dug up by now and you can plant your potatoes. That's all I could do for you from here. I love you, Ahmed."

oh puh-leese

look frankly I no longer care if Google is in bed with the CIA, being buggered by the NSA or giving a blowjob to the president.

Yes I know it matters, yes I know its our personal data and freedom at stake but for the sake of everyones sanity can we all just assume that

1) All data given to google will be passed to men who mostly wear black
2) We all have spyware on our computers anyway

Because considering that I earn my living by using the computer and looking at a lot of stuff on Google it doesn't actually make much *real* difference to me, or to most other people here, what the truth of the matter is - uunless I want to spend my days watching daytime TV while getting drunk on homebrew its a risk I choose to accept and endless discussion is not changing that fact, any more than the potential phone tap, hidden camera or e-mail monitoring is.

We cannot just keep having the same conversation every day. Its getting worse than the bloody 'how do I get my PR up to 5' stuff that we're all trying to get away from.

We cannot just keep having

We cannot just keep having the same conversation every day. Its getting worse than the bloody 'how do I get my PR up to 5' stuff that we're all trying to get away from.

this would be the second time that we're having this conversation, and it is with the presentation of additional information. if people are opposed to this, we can delete it, close it, push it out of our minds and never think about it again (which is exactly what they want), etc. seriously, though, if people dont want to talk about it or even stay informed about it i wont post this stuff, just let me know.

perhaps there is nothing that can be done, and i agree that we are all dependent upon google. i am not going to just abandon all things google, which at this point would mean abandoning most of the web. although IMO if we show a refusal to discuss these things the violation of abuse and secret power will only get worse.

since today is halloween, if anyone wants to scare themselves with dirt on the CIA, here are some keywords, have fun: project paperclip, mkultra, midnight climax, operation ajax, operation pbsuccess, project artichoke, project bluebird, operation mockingbird....the list goes on and on.

i still think an official response from google would be warranted and that if everyone demands it we can get it. yesterday the official google blog talked about diet coke and mentos, and while i'm sure that's a matter of grave concern to the webmaster community, i think there would be many who would be interested in seeing google respond to this.

and i agree that we are all

and i agree that we are all dependent upon google

Precisely why we are in this mess called GOOGLE. So-called free thinkers, innovators, first movers and technologists have kowtowed to the plex at every opportunity.

Now you sit in front of your monitor fiddle farting with a freekin adwords display/slot machine.

You've been assimilated, feed the beast.

Home brew and Jerry Springer is beginning to sound pretty good.

"The contractor, who spoke

"The contractor, who spoke on a not-for-attribution basis, said that at least one US intelligence agency he declined to identify"

C'mon, that's not an attribution - if an argument's going to be made, a proper source should be required. So far all we seem to have is Robert Steele. Multiple cross-referencing identified sources would be better.

Besides, we also seem to be lacking context in these poltical threads. Google is accused of doing *what* to *what* extent?

In the meantime, perhaps a new site suggested for filing conspiracy theories than tech/marketing - threatwatch.org?

not dependent

to be honest I'm not dependent on Google and nor are most of us I don't think, but while Google exists then fiddle farting with Google is a service we offer our clients. (I'm very tempted to change the wording of my invoices this month but perhaps it would be best not to). If google dissapear then I just fiddlefart more with Yahoo, MSN and whatever other sites happen to drive traffic nicely.

I don't kowtow to them (I hope and think) but they help write my paycheques and if they want to spend their kickback from the CIA on supporting my homebrew habit then I for one am supportive of that, given that they're getting the kickback anyway.

I also don't kowtow to the US or UK government, but I would rather protest that by shouting abuse at Tony while waving a big banner. imho it does more to change the world and the fresh air is good for me.

Google is accused of doing

Google is accused of doing *what* to *what* extent?

accused of partnering with the CIA. this most recent accusation says the partnership is to fight the "war on terror."

to what extent? great question. maybe someone at google can let us know.

the article linked to in the original post contains more information, the history of google's VC provider (sequoia) and their affiliation with the intelligence community.

The affiliation via VC is

The affiliation via VC is long a matter of public record. That doesn't imply an implicit on-going relationship between Google + CIA.

So far the revelation appears to be "Google has done stuff with the CIA". But you're saying that no one knows what or is making specific allegations?

Your civil liberties are at risk

Gurtie - as much as I'm sure that the GOOG/CIA alliance doesn't give half a crap about you personally, it's the erosion of civil liberties that is the fundamental issue to consider here. Complacency, apathy and a 'who cares' attitude are EXACTLY what is required for them to take your liberties - provided by the constitution - away from you. And it is done behind the scenes by big bankers.

Don't think the Gov't is capable of that? - how about the fact that INCOME TAX IS ILLEGAL - and always has been. Think I'm kidding? Watch Arron Russo's (producer: Trading Places, The Rose) 'Freedom to Facism' - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4312730277175242198&q=Freedom+to+facism&hl=en - which gets to the details of this. Also watch videos from EX-IRS agents that explain the law.... and ask yourself the question - "how are they 'getting away with' not paying income tax?" Well, anyone can do it: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7521758492370018023&q=Income+tax&hl=en

"CAN'T BE!" you say? Then why is the government currently debating the new "FairTax" system, or NESARA. (Search GOOG!)...

Educate yourself before you crap all over something that is protecting you... or you'll be crapping all over yourself.

Is Google Evil?

Is money green? I do think it's great though that Google allows us to see the information that proves all this.

Oh yeah, now for some halloween spookyness....

Why is the White House at the bottom tip of a massive pentagram (upside down star - satanic symbol) clearly marked in the streets of Washington DC? - http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=washington+dc&ie=UTF8&z=14&ll=38.896177,-77.028065&spn=0.040147,0.121536&t=k&om=1
Best viewed in satellite mode.

Oh yeah, I said it two years ago, and I'll say it again. Google is Big Brother.

Happy Halloween.


Oh yeah, I'm from the 52nd state: Canada. But this all reverberates around the world.... can you say: "New World Order"?


read what I said. I'm not saying its unimportant, just that in the context of Threadwatch, and of what is being achieved by having effectively the same discussion ad infinitum here, that its not relevent.

I am very far from being a 'who cares' type of person. In fact I do care about this and if you think I'm in the 'Google can do no wrong' camp then you clearly haven't read a lot I've said in the past but I don't believe everything I read online and while I think the original discussions and an occasional repeat may be valuable in drawing attention to points which people should be aware of I know the key to this crowd is to make them think - not try and dictate what they believe. People who read Threadwatch have enough brains to go construct their own conspiracy theory/news they don't need to have it spoonfed to them.

> In the meantime, perhaps a

> In the meantime, perhaps a new site suggested for filing conspiracy theories than tech/marketing - threatwatch.org?

If only. Alas, the inmates seem to have taken over the asylum at the moment....

when it comes to liberties

When it comes to civil liberties being taken away - any and ALL forums for discussion should be used to bring light to the situation until it is resolved. NOTHING IS MORE IMPORTANT. Can you agree with this? This is not something to choose where and when to talk about it - because that is what they will be imposing on us. Telling us how, when, where and what to say.

Please watch Arron's video, then tell me this is not a forum to use... it's about WAY more than income tax.

Use ALL forums, wherever there are people listening, because some may not have the truth - AND IT IS THEIR RIGHT to have it. Counting on mainstream media to disseminate the truth is a joke, because they are owned by 'the elite' who are pushing this agenda of 'New World Order'.


Hey Nutsandbolts;

You can sign up for your verichip here: http://www.verichipcorp.com/

Thanks fester! Get your

Thanks fester! Get your protection here to help you with your nightmares of the global new world order conspiracy

Btw - from the Arts Technica website:

"No hard evidence for these claims was presented"

Why let facts ruin it, eh?

I guess if you're looking

I guess if you're looking for a place that will try to keep the lipstick on a pig, there is always WMW.

Why Joke?

Nutsandbolts: The illegality of income tax is NOT a conspiracy. IT IS A FACT. If it wasn't, anyone who stated so could be arrested.... but they are NOT. (Neither are those who prove they don't have to pay income tax.) Why? BECAUSE INCOME TAX IS ILLEGAL. (No need to re-post links to these FACTUAL videos.)

You probably think money is printed by the government too. WRONG. It is printed by a PRIVATE COMPANY called The Federal Reserve - that charges interest to the government for printing American money...

Pointing fingers without facts.... who's the whackjob?

Enough Already

Please, all feel free to be disappointed in me, puzzled, even incensed by my seeming lack of social conscience, but just take it elsewhere, ferchrissake. TW was never docile or in the boondocks, but it was off the main drag and, bollocks aside, was pretty focused.

However wrong of me it may be, I'm bored.


Complacent? Disinterested? Bored? Apathetic? Factless finger pointer? ...you'll fit right in.


"When it comes to civil

"When it comes to civil liberties being taken away - any and ALL forums for discussion should be used to bring light to the situation until it is resolved. NOTHING IS MORE IMPORTANT. Can you agree with this?"


Tell us what exactly the relationship is between Google and the CIA - tell us exactly what sort of information is being relayed. As there is so much chatter, I'm presuming there's real substance and qualified statements making precise allegations.

I'm not seeing that. All I'm seeing is something Icke-esque. It's not search news. It's not technology news. It's not news.

from wikipedia

The implication of sheeple is that people believe whatever they are told, without processing it to be sure that it is an accurate representation of the real world around them. The term is generally used in a political or religious sense.

Swings both ways imho.

But that actually doesn't matter. What matters is that ThreadWatch is not the place to have repeated discussions of the same political issue. There are some fine forums which are there for exactly that, and our attention has been drawn to the issue, so now lets move the discussion to somewhere where it should be hosted (ie; not here) and start talking about SEO, SEM, whether Walmart know anything about marketing and when Sergey will next fart. OK?

here is how it directly

here is how it directly relates to your business:

1. the more of a relationship there is between the CIA and Google, the more the CIA will be able to use Google for governmental actions.

2. For instance, let's say the government says the web is being used by terrorists. so they pass a law citing the need to regulate the internet. this law states you must now pass a test to have a web site.

3. the government, via the CIA, has access to google's truth detector. so it says, if you dont pass google's truth detector, you dont pass the registration test.

4. you dont get a web site.

5. you dont make money on the web.

now, if you think all this is just a bunch of "tin foil hat conspiracy theory" and not newsworthy, fair enough. i certainly am not saying the steps outlined above will occur -- but i think it is a possible situation, particularly if we sit back and watch it happen. of course, google can offer clarification and allay concerns at any time, if it so desires.

Did you like Arron's video,

Did you like Arron's video, Brian? It's simply a pointer that someting is askew at the top. And, if that is so, this could be pervasive elsewhere in other areas of 'sensitivty' (ie: CIA) and that this potential askew-ness might reach further to use 'search habits' as a tool for the implementation of nefarious policy?

If you are an employee in the search or technology industry, a business owner in the search or technolgy industry, or a thinking, LAW ABIDING citizen, then ILLEGAL INCOME TAX is news.


>> if it so desires which

>> if it so desires

which it clearly doesn't.

>> now, if you think all this is just a bunch of "tin foil hat conspiracy theory" and not newsworthy, fair enough

The first time a similar story appeared it was an interesting and newsworthy discussion.

Frankly its offensive to the rest of us when a few of you believe that our not wanting to cover the same ground over and over on a website dedicated to something else means that we're not concerned or capable of having opinions.

SEO / technology discussion

Something to discuss on an SEO / tech level...

Let's look at this from a right/wrong perspective.

HYPOTHETICAL SCENARIO: Certain individuals who are inside the government realize that a major crime has been perpetrated on the people for the last 80 years, and they go public... BUT, mainstream press ignores them, because the powers that be THERE are involved in the scandal. Certain others within the government recognize and 'out' certain other illegal or concerning actions they have witnessed, but AGAIN, mainstream press ignores them, by orders from the top. So the truth doesn't get out.... BUT, there is this new technology that YOU have advanced knowledge of, that can help get the truth out...

SO, the SEO / tech questions I pose to all of you is:

SHOULD/WOULD you use your advanced knowledge of SEO and technology to spread FACT BASED news that is being ignored by mainstream media? Should/would you also use this advanced knowledge of SEO and technology to get further educated on these issues... and last, should/would you use this advanced knowledge of SEO and technology to demand straight answers and transparency from those who WE ARE SUPPOSED TO HAVE THE POWER OVER? The government belongs to the people.

Like it or not, we, as a group of SEO and tech people, DO have greater power than anyone to make a difference.

That's SEO news.



No No and No.

I will use my advanced knowledge of SEO and technology to help ensure that people get information from both sides of any given scenario so they can make their own minds up. Not to bloody force feed them.

Now in the name of all that's holy please, please, give it a rest. Hypothetical scenarios, shouting and repetition won't change my mind. They won't change yours and they won't change anyones.

And Off Into The Sidings We Go

I liked Sapphire and Steel, me.

They were aliens you know.

>>Sapphire and Steel Good

>>Sapphire and Steel

Good show that.

Good information about the

Good information about the sham which is the Federal Reserve
I also recently ranted about the fraud which is our current Federal Reserve
Also worth noting that many of the presidents who were against private central banks were assasinated or had assasination attempts on their lives.

Well no matter how you look

Well no matter how you look at it guys we're all screwed.

If the neo cons are plotting to take over your freedoms. the libs are sweeping the resistance's legs out from under them with their anti gun campaigns. LOL

We'll all be dead in 20

We'll all be dead in 20 years so who gives a shit?

Nothing has changed.

C'mon now! Nothing has changed. The government knows everything about you already (with or without a "partnership" with Google. Further, it makes no difference if you're logged on or not; your personal information will be used if and when the government wants/needs to use it.

So, leave Google alone and keep moving forward with whatever it is that makes you happy and successful.

I talk about all my personal

I talk about all my personal shit on Yahoo messenger. If any government gave a damn about it I would be in Siberia now. Either they don't see it or they don't care. What's the difference?

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